View source for Talk:If Type

The article states that the so-called ''if type'' is a "helper type". I need a stricter definition of both the "if type" and the concept of "helper type" in general. To help you understand what I'm asking, look at the following:

 if ( expression )

As you can see, that is an incomplete if statement. Is the term "if type" meant to refer to the part of an if statement consisting of the reserved word <tt>'''if'''</tt> followed by a boolean expression enclosed in parentheses, as exemplified above? If not, clarify in good, unambiguous english. [[User:Killswitch|Killswitch]] 02:01, 24 March 2007 (CET)
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:In the BI comref that I have the [[If Type]] is defined exactly the same way as the Wiki defines it.
:If Type to my way of seeing it is perfectly understandable:

:if exitWith code

:The ''if'' in the syntax definition represents the fact that a conditional is the first parameter.

:''if'' is the condition, which can be the condition you write that determines when to exit, in this example.

:if: [[If Type]] ... in the parameter section says what sort of conditional statement it is.

:I agree that the ''If Type'' could probably do with a better definition, but the present definition does point to :the [[if]] and [[then]] commands to aid in determining what type of condition to use.

:[[User:Planck|Planck]] 12:55, 24 March 2007 (CET)
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::The if type is quite understandable by both you and I since we're used to programming and scripting. Getting back to the actual question, the term is indeed in need of a better definition. The reason for that is how it's used on the reference pages where it occurs ([[then]],[[exitWith]]). It is potentially confusing to newcomers to use the ''reserved word'' "'''if'''" to represent an "if type condition". The reserved word '''if''' and an ''if type condition'' are different things. A similar confusing use of reserved words is seen on the [[then]] page, where the reserved word '''else''' is used to represent the [[Code]] or [[Array]] that ends an if..then construct.

::A better way of describing the syntax can be seen on the [[for_do]] page, where the part that comes before the word ''do'' is ''forCommand'', referring to a [[For_Type]]. In the end, I'm looking for two things:
::* A clear definition of the term '''if type'''.
::* Doing away with the misuse of reserved words in presenting the syntax of [[else]] and [[exitWith]].
::Perhaps we can solve the first one right here? The terms ''if type'' and ''if type condition'' might be equivalent and refer to a language construct of the following form:

::: ''IfTypeCondition:''
:::: <tt>'''if''' ( expression )</tt>

::If that can serve as a definition of the term ''if type'', the article can be improved. On the other hand, on the [[Talk:Control_Structures]] page, Suma states that 'there are actually no "Control Structures" in this scripting language, only expressions.' Would that suggest that ''if type'' is a term used to describe the result of the evaulation of an "if-expression", not the syntactic form of the "if type condition" as above?
::[[User:Killswitch|Killswitch]] 16:28, 24 March 2007 (CET)

:::For a scripting beginner it couldn't matter less what name or description is given to a command like "if".
:::What they want and need are reproducible examples to play and tinker with.
:::Some Computer Science student may find one or the other definition suspect, but if he can't figure out by himself how those commands work, then he may have picked the wrong field... --[[User:Kronzky|Kronzky]] 16:39, 24 March 2007 (CET)


::::I suppose it is possible that we could copy the forCommand term and use ifCommand in the exitWith scripting command.
::::This would remove the use of the reserved command word from the syntax definition.
::::Other reserved words could also be 'edited' so as not to lose the meaning as well.

::::I edited exitWith again, we can see how it goes, it can always be altered again if needed

::::[[User:Planck|Planck]] 16:51, 24 March 2007 (CET)

:::Exactly. '''if''' command returns a value of "if type", which is usable only as an argument for the left operand of '''then''' command. This "value" holds the condition for the is as well. If you want, you can create a constructs like this: ''ifHelper = if (condition) ifHelper then someCode''. I doubt there is a lot of practical use to this, but some may be interested to know it. --[[User:Suma|Suma]] 12:49, 22 June 2007 (CEST)